[01:45:42] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net
[13:55:57] <Fluburtur> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/236563751401160704/577831548301344808/DSC_1265.JPG
[13:57:08] <Althego> what is that? a piezo speaker and a normal?
[13:57:51] <Althego> if that is a trumpet, and the speaker works as a mic, it can be useful
[14:05:53] <Mat2ch> another crazy invention by Fluburtur :)
[14:57:24] <Eddi|zuHause> what? these things existed for decades...
[14:57:51] <Eddi|zuHause> a dampening device with a microphone, so you can practice without disturbing your neighbours
[14:59:50] <Mat2ch> interesting
[15:00:06] <Mat2ch> why the mic? To record or to listen on headphones?
[15:00:15] <Eddi|zuHause> to listen on your headphones
[15:00:38] <Eddi|zuHause> it has its disadvantages, because you need more air to play with a damper
[15:00:49] <Eddi|zuHause> there's more resistance
[15:53:42] <Althego> https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2019/05/28-years-later-hacker-fixes-rampant-slowdown-on-snes-gradius-iii/
[15:53:57] <Althego> hehe better late than never
[15:56:48] <iunio> Did you ever do orbit with SRBs ?∫
[15:57:24] <hoglahoo> yeah
[15:57:28] <iunio> I got very close to putting an orange tank in orbit with just SRBs
[15:57:57] <Althego> i always do
[15:58:03] <iunio> my dream is to do Mun capture with an SRB fired straight up. I don't know if that's possible lol.
[15:58:25] <Althego> because usually sepratrons take down the upper stage on separation
[15:58:39] <Althego> in case of really huge rockets, i use the smaller solids
[15:58:54] <iunio> I only make medium or small rockets
[15:59:05] <Althego> why straight up?
[15:59:19] <Althego> shoulkdnt it be retorograde isntead?
[15:59:25] <iunio> Because it's hard to aim SRB vehicles
[15:59:33] <Althego> but people have went to laythe with srbs only
[15:59:39] <iunio> cool
[16:00:32] <iunio> Straight up meaning (in munar reference frame) an elliptic arc
[16:04:54] <Althego> i want to go to duna with cockpit only
[16:05:02] <Althego> but i doubt that i can do it
[16:05:17] <Althego> the required precision is hard to achieve
[16:05:58] <Althego> i went to the mun with cockpit only once, but that was way easier
[16:06:58] <UmbralRaptop> I have questions 
[16:07:40] <UmbralRaptop> (I mean, aside from the making history LEM clone, how much ΔV can you get in a single cockpit?) 
[16:07:56] <Althego> "a question" - said the guardian of forever
[16:08:07] <Althego> hehe
[16:08:16] <Althego> i meant not using the map, always using the cockpit view
[16:08:57] <UmbralRaptop> Ah
[16:10:42] <Althego> how do you say "doge"?
[16:11:17] <Althego> i know, internet has transitioned from doge to doggo
[16:11:44] <UmbralRaptop> dōge
[16:12:14] <Althego> but i would like to know how you say it. i always thought it was with a hard g, since dog is too, but for the first time i heard "dogecoing" which is "dodge" coin
[16:33:19] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+v phroa' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net
[16:33:34] <UmbralRaptop> hrm. Let me try something. 
[16:34:17] <Althego> do or do not. there is no try :)
[16:34:43] <UmbralRaptop> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1daRAah7DLe8AGOfD_qBt0vHXmi0MhZ1-/view?usp=drivesdk
[16:35:31] <Althego> hehe
[16:35:37] <Althego> so dodge it is
[16:37:14] <UmbralRaptop> At least, that's my understanding 
[16:37:57] <UmbralRaptop> Also, I swear I don't live on a farm in the midwest >_<
[17:02:30] <Mat2ch> I say dooogi
[17:02:43] <Mat2ch> but a German i ;)
[17:02:50] <Mat2ch> doog-e
[17:03:02] <Althego> yes i thought of it as such
[17:03:16] <Mat2ch> It sounds much better than dodge ;)
[17:32:54] <senray> Not sure if anyone can help here, but here goes: I'm not sure what triggers it, KSP suddenly slows down in frame rate dramatically, and a subsequent docking attempt results in the target vehicle flipping and flying away rather than docking. Restart ksp puts it back to normal
[17:33:25] <senray> nothing in the log
[18:05:46] <Eddi|zuHause> your magnet is backwards?
[18:11:34] <Althego> hehe
[18:28:27] <JVFoxy> caught room mate watching the blue moon lander tech video on his stupid crazy big screen this morning...
[18:32:19] <Eddi|zuHause> why are none of my installed mods compatible with 1.7, or 1.6 for that matter?
[18:33:43] <JVFoxy> that no good...
[18:34:10] <JVFoxy> I was hoping to test some mods in a 1.6 game later.. thought I'd hold off 1.7 for the time being still.
[18:36:00] <darsie> Eddi|zuHause: officially or actually?
[18:36:22] <JVFoxy> eddi|zuHause now I'm wondering... which mods you trying out...
[18:36:34] <darsie> I have some mods not rated for 1.7 and they work.
[18:37:46] <Eddi|zuHause> darsie: i was just loading ckan and checking for updates
[18:38:04] <Eddi|zuHause> haven't actually tried running the game
[18:38:31] <Eddi|zuHause> but turns out it didn't properly refresh the list
[18:38:45] <Eddi|zuHause> now, about half the mods are available for 1.7
[18:39:04] <Eddi|zuHause> some for 1.6, which i can't update through CKAN
[18:39:36] <Eddi|zuHause> ... i don't think i'm going to play today
[18:53:14] <Althego> hehe event horizon with joe scott. youtubeception?
[19:37:13] <Eddi|zuHause> so... is there some magic incantation for CKAN to allow me to install "incompatible" mods?
[19:37:43] <darsie> yes
[19:38:03] <darsie> In some menu open a window where you can select other versions.
[19:38:08] <nate> There's usually a reason why they're incompatible though
[19:38:30] <Eddi|zuHause> yes, because they weren't updated yet...
[19:38:38] <darsie> Sometimes because their compatibility hasn't been updated to newly released versions.
[19:39:12] <Eddi|zuHause> google seems to think i should edit the ksp version in some .txt file
[19:39:37] <nate> In my experience though in the case of notable version updates (ie; 1.x) they often need some minor changes to the mods, at least from what I ran into frequently over the years lol
[19:42:40] <Eddi|zuHause> unrelated: are there music mods?
[19:42:53] <Eddi|zuHause> hearing the same 3 songs on repeat can be a bit... repetetive
[19:51:39] <JVFoxy> lol... my reasoning for incompatibility..? KSP getting updated too frequently.. but yaknow.. :P
[19:52:06] <Althego> we didnt get any major update for a long time now
[19:52:22] <darsie> Eddi|zuHause: Settings/Compatible KSP versions
[19:52:24] <Althego> since 1.4 or so?
[19:53:09] <Eddi|zuHause> was that the unity version upgrade?
[19:53:09] <JVFoxy> well I guess the argument could be said: updated very frequently, vs not updated at all
[19:53:36] <JVFoxy> Eddi|zuHause think that was when wheels went to drift mode
[19:53:48] <Althego> the wheels happened several times
[19:53:59] <Althego> first around 1.2?
[19:54:00] <JVFoxy> well more when it became a serious issue
[19:54:17] <JVFoxy> remember they had to remodel them from scratch after unity version change
[19:54:39] <Althego> at least we got a lot of settings for them because of that
[19:54:48] <Althego> scott
[19:55:13] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: so that was the same update, i guess
[19:55:18] <JVFoxy> Althego 1.1 update...
[19:56:08] <JVFoxy> 1.2, Updated Unity to 5.4.0p4 (according to game wiki) as well as some wheel improvments
[19:56:22] <Althego> it was long time ago
[19:56:30] <Althego> cant remember all these
[19:56:37] <JVFoxy> https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Version_history
[19:56:59] <JVFoxy> s'ok.. I don't remember /all/ the changes either..
[19:58:03] <Eddi|zuHause> "Landing Height Display", do i still need that or is that builtin now?
[19:58:13] <JVFoxy> built in..
[19:58:14] <Althego> what does it do?
[19:58:25] <Althego> you get radar altitude with the 1.7
[19:58:32] <Althego> available on the normal view
[19:58:36] <Eddi|zuHause> switches to height above ground instead of height above sealevel while in surface mode
[19:58:42] <JVFoxy> as of 1.7.. you can click the altitude ticker to show radar or mean height
[19:59:03] <Althego> instead of depending on the surface mode, in 1.7 the altimeter has its own mode
[19:59:12] <Eddi|zuHause> ok, so i uninstall that
[19:59:23] <Althego> there is a little blue waves icon, and a green mountain icon
[19:59:37] <Eddi|zuHause> now i have about 5 mods left that weren't even updated for 1.5
[19:59:44] <Althego> although i still dont get why they thought it was a good idea to decouple the altimeter from the navball
[20:00:01] <JVFoxy> althego decouple how so?
[20:00:08] <Althego> think of an airplane hud
[20:00:12] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: opposite sides of the screen
[20:00:17] <Althego> all the important data are in one place
[20:00:25] <JVFoxy> oh that.. top/bottom
[20:00:27] <Althego> not in ksp, the altitude is way far
[20:01:03] <JVFoxy> guessing from way back, when they first built the UI.. I find it a tad annoying at times too. Though, can just move them together I believe
[20:02:00] <JVFoxy> I wouldn't be surprised if someone's made a mod that consolidates the UI a bit more together.
[20:04:53] <JVFoxy> ugh.. dumped
[20:05:38] <JVFoxy> not sure what I missed.. was going to say: it be cool to see what sorta interface/UI ideas could be made with the flight screen. I'm more used to having stuff on the bottom, mostly together
[20:05:45] <Eddi|zuHause> swapping [X] Science for [X] Science continued...
[20:06:14] <Althego> i dont see much fun in managing mods
[20:06:20] <Eddi|zuHause> i don't either
[20:06:32] <Eddi|zuHause> but going back to unmodded is no fun either
[20:06:41] <Althego> that is why you never start it
[20:06:54] <Eddi|zuHause> i made a mistake, ok? it was JUST ONCE!
[20:07:00] <Althego> hehe
[20:07:01] <JVFoxy> now I'm wondering how hard it is to make a mod that replaces the stock flight UI... maybe something that allows you to have different versions that you can switch on the go
[20:07:17] <Althego> probably done already
[20:07:17] <JVFoxy> lol..
[20:07:39] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: you can make that unnecessarily hard by not providing any modding documentation/intefaces
[20:07:44] <JVFoxy> well I tried someone's multi mod back in earlier version.. the fact it took several minutes just to load seriously put me off for a long while
[20:08:27] <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, game takes 5 minutes to load with mods, in that time i've completly lost the enthusiasm to actually play
[20:08:36] <Althego> hehe
[20:09:31] <JVFoxy> Eddi|zuHause ya but is it doable even? suppose could try for something of an 'airplay' style layout a test, go from there. Doesn't have to be airplane.. though, do wonder what sorta style instruments would be appealing
[20:10:03] <JVFoxy> try having to reload many times while testing things like a particular mod or something.
[20:10:04] <Althego> cant be airplane, one more dimension
[20:10:05] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: dunno, depends how deep into the game core the modding interfaces go
[20:10:28] <JVFoxy> Althego lol... airplane is already 3d... same with Heli
[20:10:36] <JVFoxy> time?
[20:10:38] <Althego> yes but airplanes hav an adi and a hsi
[20:10:42] <Althego> ksp has only a navball
[20:10:48] <Althego> that combined the two
[20:10:56] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: when i started installing mods, i spent all my time bisecting to find which mod causes slowdowns, ect. and never playing again for like half a year
[20:11:08] <Althego> which works fine as long as you dont add the additional elements like glideslope and stuff
[20:11:38] <JVFoxy> Althego hate to ask... you flown planes before?
[20:11:45] <Althego> not real ones
[20:12:02] <JVFoxy> so sim but you familiar in some ways?
[20:12:08] <Althego> but worked for aircraft simulation company for 8 years
[20:12:43] <Althego> strangely enough ksp helps you fly helicopters
[20:12:49] <JVFoxy> Eiddi|zuHause I wouldn't mind some mods.. limit things. Just I guess friend went a little too ham on putting in mods. Asked if I could test a design for them the one time.
[20:15:22] <Eddi|zuHause> enough of this, i actually try starting the game now...
[20:15:23] <JVFoxy> way I see nav-ball is, its a proper artificial horizon.. rather than adding more UI for navigating, they just threw in markers on it. Which is fine too.. does help to consolidate things a bit. Apollo and other things, they had an AH as well, but most of the navigating was done by numbers.. takes a bit more knowhow
[20:15:47] <Althego> yes i think they took the idea from there
[20:15:58] <Eddi|zuHause> i miss an option to rotate the navball without rotating the ship
[20:16:14] <Althego> i think only kerbals can do that
[20:16:31] <JVFoxy> rotate.. eh how so?
[20:16:38] <Althego> couple it with the camera
[20:16:41] <Althego> not with heading
[20:16:56] <Eddi|zuHause> JVFoxy: sometimes markers hide at the edges
[20:17:11] <JVFoxy> ok so not orientation thing like they did with landercans?
[20:17:23] <Eddi|zuHause> dunno what you mean
[20:17:36] <Althego> the lander cans have 2 orientations
[20:17:39] <JVFoxy> 3 actually
[20:17:42] <Althego> they realized people use them for cars
[20:17:42] <JVFoxy> reverse too
[20:17:51] <Eddi|zuHause> ah that, no
[20:17:52] <Althego> so now you can roate the navball reference of them 90 deg
[20:18:02] <Eddi|zuHause> that's great, but not what i mean
[20:18:05] <JVFoxy> oh..
[20:18:17] <JVFoxy> well they have up, straight out window, /and/ a down as I found out. >.<
[20:18:36] <JVFoxy> went to go from straight out window to up, instead it threw me upside down
[20:19:19] <Eddi|zuHause> oh great, things crashed
[20:19:30] <JVFoxy> but anyways... ya, old days I woudl throw a probe core somewhere. or docking point. I think some people still do for shuttle like things so they can still maintain a particular pitch during flight
[20:19:38] <Althego> crash, taht reminds me, when is the spacex
[20:19:39] <Eddi|zuHause> (i think it was pulseaudio)
[20:20:17] <Althego> still thursday before dawn
[20:20:27] <JVFoxy> heavy right?
[20:20:29] <Althego> but it is only 1 hour before i wake up officially
[20:20:33] <Althego> no, normal
[20:20:40] <Althego> next heavy is maybe next month
[20:20:44] <JVFoxy> ah right
[20:21:26] <Althego> still cant see the satellites in that https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1127388838362378241
[20:21:28] <JVFoxy> huh.. some lightsail thing going up on heavy
[20:21:38] <Eddi|zuHause> out of memory?
[20:21:42] <Althego> what, why would you need a falcon ehavy for that
[20:22:07] <JVFoxy> geeze... thing looks like an exposed memory core or something
[20:23:36] <Althego> so it is 30 something tall
[20:23:37] <JVFoxy> lighsail 2 is a secondary payload
[20:23:44] <Althego> so it must ve 2 towers
[20:23:53] <Althego> is that the plaentary society?
[20:23:58] <Althego> or what is their name
[20:24:10] <JVFoxy> primary is a US airforce certification flight
[20:24:21] <UmbralRaptop> planetary society, yeah 
[20:24:56] <Eddi|zuHause> quit some java app, now having a bit more spare memory...
[20:25:44] <JVFoxy> heavy will also have some other secondary payloads too
[20:25:51] <Althego> hehe java
[20:26:45] <Eddi|zuHause> KSP using 25% memory, which is like 3GB
[20:26:54] <Althego> normal
[20:27:52] <Eddi|zuHause> now... there was some setting i wanted to change last time i played, which i always forgot and when ingame i couln't change it, then i forgot it again on logging out. anyone remember what it was?
[20:28:19] <Althego> lol
[20:28:31] <Eddi|zuHause> might have been some of the hnjlki buttons
[20:28:35] <Althego> advanced tweakables?
[20:28:37] <Eddi|zuHause> but which way around?
[20:28:50] <Althego> i always fluip the up down
[20:28:54] <Althego> because w should be up
[20:28:59] <Althego> same for i
[20:35:13] <Mat2ch> Althego: the sats are very very flat and stacked on top of each other in two rows
[20:35:35] <Althego> i just couldnt believe they are so flat
[20:37:15] <Eddi|zuHause> oh. the load dialog, still not sorted by date
[20:37:31] <Mat2ch> well, they are still around 30 cm high, which is enough for control circuits, tanks and thrusters
[20:38:33] <Eddi|zuHause> where are savegames stored again?
[20:38:47] <Althego> in saves?
[20:39:11] <UmbralRaptop> KSP/Saves/savename I think? 
[20:39:12] <Althego> saves, then the game name, then the files.sfs
[20:39:18] <Eddi|zuHause> ah
[20:41:07] <Eddi|zuHause> "Vessel [...] is missing part KAS.CPort1"
[20:41:32] <Eddi|zuHause> what's the worst that can happen?
[20:42:19] <UmbralRaptop> vessel gets eaten by a garbage collector, and the kerbals instantly die 
[20:44:10] <Althego> how was the it, the neutrino flux alone is lethal
[20:46:27] <UmbralRaptop> Some of those missions were fun to write 
[20:51:42] <Guest11959> e
[20:51:49] <Althego> 7m?
[20:52:04] <Eddi|zuHause> hmm... the quickload window (rshift+f9) seems broken, it always jumps back to the first one when i try to scroll to select something
[20:52:42] <Guest11959> rip
[20:52:58] <Guest11959> graagdsafdghdddfggzzffgggde
[20:53:10] Action: UmbralRaptop pokes Guest11959 with a stick 
[20:54:19] <Guest11959> wat
[20:54:40] <UmbralRaptop> It's best not to die on your keyboard 
[20:54:58] <Guest11959> sorry i was being beat by my mother
[20:55:39] <Neal> could a rocket engine be considered a jet?
[20:55:44] <Althego> it is a jet
[20:55:58] <Althego> that is why jpl is called jet propulsion laboratory
[20:56:00] <Guest11959> but without air intake
[20:56:10] <Guest11959> oxidizer intake
[20:56:25] <Neal> yeah a rocket is defined as carrying all components needed for propulsion onboard
[20:56:30] <Althego> but today that word is not used as such anymore
[20:56:52] <Guest11959> what word?
[20:56:58] <Neal> I'm having a heated argument over why DICE is wrong about calling the V1 in BF5 a "rocket"
[20:57:23] <Guest11959> V1 is a rocket
[20:57:29] <Althego> v1 was totally a jet
[20:57:33] <Althego> used a pulsejet engine
[20:57:38] <Althego> had wings
[20:57:46] <Guest11959> Wait I was thinking of V2 
[20:57:56] <Guest11959> V1 is a jet yeah
[20:59:21] <Eddi|zuHause> wtf is wrong with this load window? makes me mad
[21:00:29] <Althego> ad is no good. that is why be a no-mad :)
[21:00:47] <Neal> rip chat
[21:00:58] <Eddi|zuHause> seems to be related to alt+tab?
[21:02:07] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptor' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net
[21:03:58] <Eddi|zuHause> hm... i was certain i had 6 kerbals on this ship, but i can find only 5?
[21:05:07] <Neal> ksp doesn;t like alt tabbing while loading I've noticed
[21:05:57] <Eddi|zuHause> not while loading, just in the selection for which game to load
[21:07:24] <Neal> which menu is that on?
[21:08:22] <Eddi|zuHause> rshift+f9 or esc->load game (while in a vessel, not tracking station)
[21:11:21] <darsie> Neal: No problem on my debian GNU/Linux.
[21:11:52] <Neal> my experience with ksp is on windows
[21:11:58] <Neal> if you have it on fullscreen it acts up
[21:12:18] <Neal> windowed mode doesn't have that issue
[21:13:45] <Mat2ch> darsie: that's because there's no real "fullscreen" in xorg ;)
[21:14:07] <darsie> ic
[21:14:26] <Mat2ch> just an instruction to the window manager to put that screen on maximum resolution in front of everything else...
[21:37:05] <flayer> what's 'full screen' do if not that?
[21:39:52] <Eddi|zuHause> so... any explanation for the missing kerbal?
[21:40:12] <Eddi|zuHause> i have savegames landed with 6 kerbals, or earlier savegames in orbit with 5 kerbals
[21:40:33] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net
[21:42:05] <Eddi|zuHause> ah, i found it, i think
[21:42:09] <Eddi|zuHause> in a command seat...
[21:42:31] <darsie> flayer: Direct access of the graphics hardware without windows?
[21:42:54] <flayer> why is that the definition of full screen?
[21:42:58] <darsie> Or via libraries/OS, too.
[21:43:36] <darsie> Fullscreen, in computing, a display which covers the full screen without the operating system's typical window-framing interface https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fullscreen
[21:44:29] <Eddi|zuHause> darsie: that's not the same thing as direct hardware access
[21:44:36] <darsie> yes
[21:45:59] <Eddi|zuHause> my savegame is still called "1_3_0"
[21:57:11] <Eddi|zuHause> gah, seems i didn't make a quicksave in the right moment back then, and the autosaves are in kinda unsuitible moments
[22:42:49] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptor' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net
[22:49:28] Last message repeated 2 time(s).
[22:49:28] <JVFoxy> whoops.. try this again. after cleaning up coffee spill on keybord. :\
[22:49:56] <JVFoxy> then cleaning keyboard while I'm at it... and now.. ugh, trying to get used to the feel of it after a trough clean out.
[22:50:03] <JVFoxy> *thorough....
[22:54:39] <sandbox_> hope it's ok
[22:55:47] <sandbox_> keybord trough
[23:00:14] <JVFoxy> seems to be ok now.. had to do a second wipedown on the internal membranes.. kept misreading after the first try
[23:16:11] <Fluburtur> piezo on a trumpet
[23:16:11] <Fluburtur> for recording it
[23:26:08] <JVFoxy> .../
[23:26:31] <JVFoxy> ... oops..
[23:42:47] <darsie> Fluburtur: How does it handle the lows?
[23:54:06] <Eddi|zuHause> i imagine there exist dedicated (i.e. expensive) microphones for instruments