[00:33:57] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [01:02:25] wow [01:02:41] esper webchat didnt save or fetch the chat history [01:02:42] sad [01:03:29] could someone recap the last 8 hours about wiki userscript? [01:07:32] Bebiezaza: Does that help? https://paste.debian.net/1220476 [01:08:21] Bebiezaza: last time someone spoke before you is... you [01:11:11] darsie yes, that helped. [01:11:36] XXCoder oh 🙃 [01:11:53] :) [01:32:04] that's why I ignore JOIN/PART/QUIT in this channel [01:33:37] mine is filtered by norepeat plugin i made [01:33:53] after 2 join and leaves, it stops any new ones from same person [01:45:44] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o raptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [05:22:06] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o UmbralRaptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [05:28:07] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o Althego' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [06:42:29] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+v Mod9000' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [10:28:19] aaaaaaand James Webb is delayed again. [10:28:56] yeah something snapped [10:29:01] vibrated whole thing. [10:29:09] i wonder if that means complete checkover [10:29:12] https://www.arianespace.com/corporate-news/nasa-update-webb-telescope-launch-arianespace/ [10:29:22] they just want to check that one instrument [10:29:57] oh, the article I first read just said one instrument, not the whole thing [10:30:29] tbh, if it just jumped around a bit it should be fine. If it hit something, then maybe not. [10:30:41] But that's the anomaly teams decision to make. [10:30:46] yeah [10:30:57] have to checkover i think, because launching is very expensive [10:31:00] (during the launch it will wiggle around a lot more, so I hope it's fine) [10:31:07] I'd wanna make sure, too. [10:31:10] Just to be safe [10:31:30] i remember one that was launched, and fairings failed to open, so probe was trapped in it as it fell back to earth [10:31:33] cost millions [10:31:46] It's a cheap thing to do in comparison to the whole craft [10:32:01] yep cheaper than merely launch too [10:32:18] " A sudden, unplanned release of a clamp band – which secures Webb to the launch vehicle adapter – caused a vibration throughout the observatory." [10:32:48] and until Starship is ready there will be no option to send someone to repair it. [10:35:46] There will be no repair missions, IMHO. [10:36:16] sucks [10:36:37] webb delayed [10:36:58] i'm still optimistic [10:37:02] It's difficult to repair because it was not made to be repaired. [10:37:59] Manned missions to L2 are long and dangerous. There could be a CME. [10:40:53] i just want webb up there, looking at stuff [10:43:23] Cross your thumbs. [10:48:47] darsie: not planned now. But when you got a huge rocket at your service which could launch repair missions, what do you think will happen? [10:50:33] Some idiot will fly there in a week, take it apart for a week, replace a thing, put it all together, loose a screw, replace it with chewing gum, fly back home for a week. [10:50:53] that will happen if we can repair it easily... [10:52:15] We could zip a balloon around it and repair it in a pressurized environment so we don't need space suits. [10:52:29] It could be the start of the L2 society. [10:52:57] We could build a new one for 500 MUSD. [10:55:57] zip a balloon around it to do repair... [10:56:01] you should work for ESA [11:00:41] :) [15:37:28] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o Althego' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [16:49:06] for what would menkind need space [16:51:33] For their bodies. [16:55:04] for what would menkind need the space outside of the earth, moon, mars and else [16:55:13] for example tourism [16:55:20] or getting ressources [16:55:23] or create energy [16:55:30] or colonization [16:55:39] any other ideas? [16:56:01] or send atom rubbish into the sun [16:57:31] resources can be found everywhere [16:58:20] sure [17:01:09] We don't need to do any of that. But we want to. [17:02:09] i hope one day we will need to [17:03:31] planetary defense against stones from space [17:05:52] More celestial bodies make larger telescopes possible, so to speak, just as we on Earth can connect several distant telescopes together to form one giant telescope. [17:06:09] or is this wrong? [17:11:51] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+ovv Althego lol768 phroa' by catastrophe.esper.net [17:51:45] using celestial bodies is probably way more work than just keeping telescopes in space [17:54:18] non-circular orbits and a general hassle to intercept and land upon [17:54:30] using them? [17:54:45] as telescopes [17:54:56] why [17:55:06] why should we use them as telescopes [17:55:19] i must have missunderstood you [17:55:26] i thought that was what you suggested [17:55:42] misunderstood* [17:56:08] I meant telescopes could be positioned at other places [17:56:15] so they can have greater distances [17:56:30] for them to combine them being together one large telescope [17:57:01] yes, that is a thing [17:57:54] https://www.worldscientific.com/doi/abs/10.1142/S225117171850006X?journalCode=jai [18:14:11] As best I'm aware telescope-wise the more serious proposals are radio telescopes on the lunar far side, using the sun's gravity focus, and very long baseline shenanigans [18:14:41] what on earth is a gravity focus [18:15:10] Gravitational lensing? [18:15:23] from the sun? [18:15:29] yeah [18:15:31] wow [18:15:43] i was unaware we could use lensing on such small scales [18:15:47] "small" [18:15:51] i think that needs to be 150 au away from the sun [18:16:08] so not on the moon? [18:16:21] the moon is the radio telescope on the far side [18:16:31] because the moon blocks out the radio noise from earth [18:16:51] so the 150au is what exactly [18:16:55] the sun gravitational lens telescope needs to be far because the sun is not a strong lens [18:17:01] eg: https://www.centauri-dreams.org/2006/08/18/the-focal-mission-to-the-suns-gravity-lens/ [18:17:23] ok 550 [18:17:25] even farther [18:17:29] i didnt remember correctly [18:17:31] 550 au because that's about he focal length. gravitational lenses are odd [18:18:19] i thought you tried to explain that we could use a radio telescope on the moon, 150 au from the sun [18:18:21] Use your mom. [18:18:23] my brain melted [18:18:25] darsie: you can be a mom [18:18:38] darsie: mommy! [18:18:43] How? [18:18:47] moth mommy? [18:18:54] hm [18:18:58] Uterus implant? [18:19:03] Action: raptop sets up some lämps [18:19:16] hehe [18:19:36] The lunar farside telescope would be a seperate thing [18:20:50] there is this idea of 3 probes trailing earth and working as a large gravitational wave detector [18:20:58] i like that [18:21:12] eLISA? [18:21:18] you need only vacuum between them, so you essentially can get rid of all the tunnels and pipes [18:21:44] i think so [18:56:43] well, the decision if eLISA will be flown should be made until 2025. How many years will it take to build them and launch them? [19:03:56] Apparently quite a while since I think the target launch date is 2034? [19:06:17] I haven't seen a launch date... [19:06:45] a launch date... when people go and watch a launch together? [19:08:18] hmm [19:23:59] what can we do outside of earth what we cant do here? [19:24:32] you can fly on titan [19:24:45] you can experience zero g [19:24:50] you can see earth from outside [19:24:59] you can have space telescopes [19:25:56] Supposedly there are cool manufacturing things you can do with microgravity and high vacuum, but AFAIK that's been hyped up with nothing to show since at least the 1980s [19:26:23] well, yes, you can technically make new alloys for example [19:26:28] fiber optics is the one I've heard the most about [19:26:29] but then nobody did anything useful [19:26:59] heat dissipation would be a pain. and the radiators would have to be able to handle mmod [19:29:05] Anyone who says Lunar He-3 is at high risk of being stabbed by raptors [19:30:23] speaking of the moon. does the moons weird-ass gravity field cleanup the space around it? [19:30:24] but without power, there will be not enough light, and in the darkness you are likely to be eaten by a grue [19:30:29] so grue or raptor [19:31:03] umaxtu: I want to say yes, but also wouldn't risk my life on it without doing some studies first [19:32:26] Action: raptop wonders if there are relevant papers in NTRS [19:37:02] Am I a bad person for suggesting orange tank + skipper to a player asking for an SSTO? [19:38:48] hehe [19:38:49] it works [19:39:29] I try to avoid SSTOs because they tend to leave debris in orbit [19:39:49] first stage to suborbital [19:39:52] raptop: Second rocket can be SSTO. [19:40:57] fair [19:41:03] 16 FT100 or so, Swivel, capsule. [19:52:51] https://www.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/k3gjzi/how_to_orbit_kerbin_on_your_second_launch_and/ [19:53:36] usually i have the problem how not to orbit kerbin on the first launch [19:55:43] easy. capsule, flea with reduced thrust [19:56:08] unbelievable [19:56:26] Doesn't even have enough dv. [19:56:45] but accomplishes the goal of not orbiting [19:56:51] ah :) [21:11:53] Action: darsie tries to get to orbit with two solids. [21:12:52] Action: raptop wants to say that you can do SSTO orbiters with making history SRBs [21:27:02] the Clydesdale is a beast on its own. but sometimes one needs several of them to get off the ground ;) [21:29:58] Worked with Thumper+Hammer, but not purely prograde. [21:30:09] (except for launch) [21:30:27] I thought you were talking about the horses there for a second [21:30:52] awesome horses btw [21:31:47] I didn't know about them. [21:32:33] awesome boosters, too [22:01:09] packbart: Recoverable SSTO rockets are good [22:01:17] much easier than spaceplanes [22:08:53] In a KSP context, it feels like it's harder to do the recovery part with rockets, but harder to get the spaceplanes into orbit [22:18:10] FLHerne: I've got the monies and unrecovered boosters don't clutter up Kerbin's oceans [22:19:16] my goal only to launch on hydrogen engines in a JNSQ scale is hard enough without landing those things ;) [22:19:59] raptop: nah, you just put little wings on the rocket [22:21:43] Action: raptop should probably try more gliding recoveries then [22:29:16] i generally just go for a 70/40 km deorbit and then burn like 300-400 dv retrograde at 40 km to bring her in. put out some flaps to burn off additional speed [22:29:58] then i throw out the drogues and regular parachutes to make sure i only need to burn a tiny little bit at touchdown for a safe landing [22:30:51] and to make it possible to land while avoiding having to do an extremely careful landing burn [22:39:05] flyback boosters are the way https://imgur.com/xDek8m5 [22:40:48] i might try that [22:50:29] #KSPOfficial: mode change '+o raptop' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.esper.net [23:01:11] ;mission [23:01:11] raptop: You try to download the newest update. #KSPOfficial has to be cycled to clean up your mess. [23:01:32] Remember when accidentally DDoSing the servers was normal? [23:02:21] automatic update stampedes are still a bit of a problem [23:03:26] Action: packbart updates the Steam client [23:16:09] pretty good combo lol